Kristol Method to the Madness
Bill Kristol, a real salt-of-the-earth type, heroically defends the American people against snooty Barack Obama’s Marxist analysis. Wingnuts rejoice. It’s impossible to over-estimate how much Kristol’s smear-job has greased the gears of the great wingnut propaganda machine; he’s opened the rightwing’s entire Cold War archive of pinko-egghead bashing for them to recycle. But then this was probably an inevitable development: wingnuts have little imagination, and so what they did to, say, smear and sabotage the intelligent, urbane Illinoisan Adlai Stevenson was bound to be repeated on the intelligent, urbane Illinoisan Mr. Obama. Yadda yadda yadda.
Anyway… Is what Obama said true? Kristol says no:
My occasion for spending a little time once again with the old Communist was Barack Obama’s now-famous comment at an April 6 San Francisco fund-raiser. Obama was explaining his trouble winning over small-town, working-class voters: “It’s not surprising then that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren’t like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.”
This sent me to Marx’s famous statement about religion in the introduction to his “Contribution to the Critique of Hegel’s Philosophy of Right”:
“Religious suffering is at the same time an expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the sentiment of a heartless world, and the soul of a soulless condition. It is the opium of the people.”
Or, more succinctly, and in the original German in which Marx somehow always sounds better: “Die Religion … ist das Opium des Volkes.”
Now, this is a point of view with a long intellectual pedigree prior to Marx, and many vocal adherents continuing into the 21st century. I don’t believe the claim is true, but it’s certainly worth considering, in college classrooms and beyond.
But it’s one thing for a German thinker to assert that “religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature.” It’s another thing for an American presidential candidate to claim that we “cling to … religion” out of economic frustration.
I think Bill Kristol is a lying liar. About Obama, yes, but also about himself. Let’s say, for the sake of argument, that Obama really meant what he said in the most “Marxist” sort of way. So what? At worst, it’s a dispassionate if unflattering analysis of a politically-misguided group. More likely, it’s an empathetic analysis of a frustrating but pitiable group.
Either way, Obama’s intent was not cynical and exploitative — which is more than can be said for the Kristol family’s position in re: the opiate of the masses. Truly rotten people like the Kristomethodists agree that religion is an opiate, but think that’s a wonderful thing, and demand that everyone start planting poppies.
Here’s Irving Kristol, courtesy of J. David Hoeveler, Jr.:
Kristol identified a spiritual vacuum that cut across the whole public culture of the United States. He was a writer who could cry out for censorship of pornography and who could praise Victorian culture for its deference to womanhood. What Kristol sorely lamented was the loss of republican virtue in Western life, and behind that loss, he believed, was the decline of religion. The decline did not constitute for Kristol a merely curious cultural shift. It lay at the base of every issue that liberal and conservative ideologies confronted. The loss of faith, Kristol wrote, was the “most important political fact of the last hundred years.” In fact, he said, the death of God “haunts bourgeois society.” The decay of religious values, he believed, had left the moral and spiritual stock of Western democracies depleted.
[…]
Kristol called himself “a believer” but did not participate in Jewish religious life “as much as I should.” Furthermore, he generally valued religion for its social effects, for the public discipline and stability it promoted, more than for the cleansing of the individual soul. “People need religion,” he said. “It’s a vehicle for a moral tradition. A crucial role. Nothing can take its place.” …By the 1980s, furthermore, Kristol doubted that any way out of the…malaise could be effected apart from an authentic religious recovery.
And here’s John Derbyshire’s frank consideration of Gertrude Himmelfarb:
Boob Bait For The Bubbas [John Derbyshire]
A colleague referred me to this piece in Reason magazine as background to Gertrude Himmelfarb’s position. It is… enlightening.
We seem to be in Straussian “noble lie” territory here. Sample:
“Kristol [Himmelfarb’s hubby] agrees with this view. ‘There are
different kinds of truths for different kinds of people,’ he says in
an interview. ‘There are truths appropriate for children; truths that
are appropriate for students; truths that are appropriate for educated
adults; and truths that are appropriate for highly educated adults,
and the notion that there should be one set of truths available to
everyone is a modern democratic fallacy. It doesn’t work.'”Translation: “We cognitive elites know religion is a crock, but it
helps keep the bubbas in line, so we must pretend to be in sympathy
with it.”This line of thinking seems to me to be unspeakably horrible and
inhuman, though, yes, I am aware that it has a long pedigree. If
that’s conservatism, I want out.
Horrible and inhuman, yes. And also, in the truest sense, elitist.
I doubt fruitcake Bill has fallen far from this poison tree.
Kill Bill
Isn’t Kristol also the guy who claimed he couldn’t address the scientific validity of the theory of evolution (because doing so might be controversial in the Republican party)?
Does it make me a eugenicist to suggest that these people are an insidious offshoot of the Homo Sapiens Sapiens species? Too bad.
These people are an insidious offshoot of the Homo Sapiens Sapiens species.
And here’s a good take on Barry Hussein’s comment:
Shit Kicker Karma
I can’t wait to hear from former Black Panther radical Marxist David Horowitz on how everyone else is the Islamo-Communist menace.
Kill Bill
I will offer this two-word comment as proof that the elitist left plans to exterminate all honest, god-fearing working Americans along with their benevolent leadership.
Does Bill Kristol eat foie gras?
Does Bill Kristol eat foie gras?
If a good ol’ American religion like Christianity or Judaism endorses the eating of foie gras, it’s good enough for Kristol to endorse eating.
I’d just like to point out that, from some of the analysis’ I’ve read of Marx, the whole ‘opiate of the people’ thing is vastly overplayed for what was actually a pretty good statement at the time.
Opium wasn’t considered as awful and horrible and terrible at the time Marx wrote his stuff as it is now that we’re enlightened and brilliant and modern and so above it all. Calling it an opium of the people only became a slam of religion as the moral outrage of Kristol’s forefathers rose to a fever pitch.
Here’s my schedule for today:
Get up
Situps/pushups
Eat cereal
Shower
Take subway to work
Work
Eat sandwich
Work
Take subway home
Eat porkchop, broccoli, mac-and-cheese
Hang out with wife
Blog
Watch TV
Go to bed
I’m an Obama supporter, and I live in an urban area. Does that sound like the life of an elitist freak to you? Other than a few perks (ability to take public transport, blogging), I’d say I’m no different than this mythological Heartland Man that everyone from Stalkin’ Malkin to MoDo to InstaRobotLover keep talking about.
Know who is different than the Heartland Man? A guy- we’ll just call him Kill Bristol- who probably has a schedule like this:
Get up
Half-assedly write fact-free column for one of the biggest newspapers in the country
Blog various Surge!!! propaganda pieces for the magazine that he runs
Eat lunch at a chic NYC cafe
Blog various LOL SNOBAMA!!!! propaganda pieces for the magazine that he runs
Pay $100 for dinner
Attend wine-and-cheese party with other opinion leaders, exchange variosu ways to “define the message” for Election 2008
Go to bed
These people couldn’t project more if they tried.
Eh, crap, that’s a very clever way to spell “various” incorrectly…
These people couldn’t project more if they tried.
It’s always about the projection. And I’m no longer sure whether it’s a clever rhetorical tactic or whether it’s entirely subconcious.
Kristol’s no dummy; he’s just crazy. He knows the dirty truth: redneck, working class, rural white males are not going to vote for Senator Obama simply becaue he’s black and for no other compelling reason (since, after all, he probably best represents their political interests).
If the wingnuts weren’t such fucking cowards they would just openly call Obama an uppity liberal n****r, which is what they really want to say.
Actually, I think there are some redneck working class rural white males who will vote for Obama, and the fact that Bill Kristol thinks they’re going to change their minds because Obama said “arugula” is an example of condescension and lack of understanding on the part of Bill Kristol.
I wonder when was the last time Bill Kristol actually spoke or met face to face with a working class rural white male?
MoDo, too. When was the last time MoDo traversed the Lincoln Tunnel?
Actually, although I’m not usually a fan of rape metaphors, I can’t resist pointing out that they really see religion as GHB.
[Oh, NOW I see why you all hate wordpress so much.]
“My occasion for spending a little time once again with the old Communist …”
Gee, it’s nice that Billy-boy still visits his dad. What? That’s not what he meant?
Oh, right. As I recently posted here under the nom de spume Irving Kristol, “But I wised up. I figured if I longed for a totalitarian police state, my best bet would be to throw in with the GOP. Also, I had to find some way to pay for little Billy’s orthodontia.”
Obama’s not saying people BECOME religious in hard times, but that they turn to it then. So does Kristol think people don’t turn to religion in hard times? Not only is he obviously not religious, he apparently doesn’t even know anyone who is. “I’ll pray for you,” “trust in the Lord,” etc, are common responses to people in pain, there are even lists of hymns and Bible texts for “comforting the afflicted.”
May ah be cynical fo’ a bit? ah hope yo’ doesn’t mind, but wif Bareeck Obama’s latess barrage of mawkish platitudes, ah cain’t resist th’ urge t’make a few cynical comments. By way of intryduckshun, let me jest say thet I, hardhaided cynic thet ah’s, is not fooled by Obama’s boisterous an’ eristic rheto’ic. ah tharfo’e gladly accepp th’ responsibility of notifyin’ others thet Obama’s th’ type of varmint who will trump up enny lie fo’ th’ occashun, an’ th’ mo’e of a thoomper it is, th’ better he likes it. Thar is sumpin grievously wrong wif them bookish sluggards who spew fo’th igno’ance an’ prejudice. Shame on th’ lot of them! Fry mah hide! Th’ quesshun thass on ev’ryone’s mind these days is, “Will peelin’ back th’ onion of Obama’s corntemppuous, naive offhan’ remarks cuz Obama t’shed tears o’ will it merely inhance his desuhe t’pan’er t’lethargic militant-types?” While ah doesn’t knows th’ answer t’thet particular quesshun, ah do knows thet enny rashunal argoomnt muss acsmarts this. His pea-brained, pighaided opinions, natcherly, does not. We muss give t’trimenjusotry no sanckshun, t’persecushun no assistance. To recapitulate, Bareeck Obama wishes he c’d buy “ethnic cleanser” at th’ grocery sto’e.
See? I can talk just like people in The Heartland!
Bill Kristol = Bi Silk Troll
Much of the public discussion of Straussianism is a load of nonsense.
But this aspect of it is spot on.
Many Straussians* believe that religion falls into the category of “necessary truths,” i.e. actual falsehoods that are needed to keep the City (i.e. society) from falling apart and to spur citizens toward virtue (which is all most of them are good for as they are not qualified to be philosophers).
(* There are in fact some actually religious Straussians, but the Kristols are not among them….and there’s a good case to be made that the religious Straussians simply misunderstand the Master.)
Ode to Word Press:
How do I hate thee?
Let me count the ways!
I hate thee to the depth and breadth and height
of Bill Kristol’s mangy old body stretched on a
massage table in Madame Kiki’s emporium.
I hate thee like unto the hatred I bear Darth Cheney.
I despise thee as though it were a roomful of neocons
plotting coal fired plants in every back yard.
We are Republicans, and don’t propose to leave our party and identify ourselves with the party whose antecedents have been rum, Romanism, and rebellion.
Actually, I think there are some redneck working class rural white males who will vote for Obama, and the fact that Bill Kristol thinks they’re going to change their minds because Obama said “arugula” is an example of condescension and lack of understanding on the part of Bill Kristol.
I think that’s exactly right. I think that’s what scares the Kristols of the punditocracy the most. They don’t understand it and they really, really don’t like having their handy dandy little world view all challenged like that. After all, Obama won handily in Iowa, and not only in the urban areas where there is an actual African-American community. He did well with rural white men and women.
If the wingnuts weren’t such fucking cowards they would just openly call Obama an uppity liberal n****r, which is what they really want to say.
They will be soon. They’re surely calling him that and more behind closed doors.
We are Republicans, and don’t propose to leave our party and identify ourselves with the party whose antecedents have been rum, Romanism, and rebellion.
A party built on rum, sodomy and the lash is a different story.
I particularly love all the pundits in DC and NYC pile on the guy from llinois for being “out of touch with the Heartland”.
Where is that Heartland these days, anyway? I think they redrew the borders again.
OT, but you’re missin a major news story:
Alan Keyes officially leaves GOP and hardly anyone notices
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/04/alankeyeswho.html
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/04/obamaflagpinlap.html
Sweet Baby Jebus in a side car! NOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooOOOOOOOOOOO!
Yes, this is OT as well, but damn-it Barack, stick to yer principles man!
I’ve never actually seen “eristic” used outside of a Discordian text before. I’m very glad that there is a one-word term for arguing for the sake being a belligerent douche, though. I learned something cool today, yay!
Obama is a snarky condescending bastard
He owes these people an apology that makes his race speech look like a greeting card.
We are Republicans, and don’t propose to leave our party and identify ourselves with the party whose antecedents have been rum, Romanism, and rebellion.
A party built on rum, sodomy and the lash is a different story.
An album built on same? Delightful.
actor212,
As one of the handful of people who seem actually upset about Obama’s “bitter” comment, do you find it at all odd that every single person who is actually upset about it, including yourself, already couldn’t stand Barack Obama?
Y’know who I think is a condescending bastard?
People that roll out archetypal Flyover-Country names like “Flo” or “Red” when talking about much of a snarky condescending bastard Obama is supposed to be, please, will he be that for us?
Why not just call them Billy-Bob and Lulu-Belle Hicksville.
Okay so the worst that can be said is that he’s talked down to some people. Next.
Yay! The HillTroll is back!
I’d just like to point out that, from some of the analysis’ I’ve read of Marx, the whole ‘opiate of the people’ thing is vastly overplayed for what was actually a pretty good statement at the time. – Patkin
I am a quasi-religious person myself and actually think “religion is the opiate of the masses” is pretty spot on. Like an opiate, religion can relieve pain and even start healing. But like an opiate, it can be addictive and destructive.
I find it rather puzzling that Obama — himself a religious person if not exactly in the Jebus loves me way that has become the sine qua non of religiosity in this country(*) — says something spot on about religion, etc., and gets raked over the coals for it, whilst a bunch o’ quasi-Commie neo-cons can say the most patronizing things about religiosity and middle America and be viewed practically as sociologists? Even when religious right figures try to quote Founders about religion in American life they usually quote some Framer being a patronizing SOB about “the masses” rather than showing any indication that any Framer wanted religion in public life.
It’s all very telling — you’d think so-called news analysists would analyze such things or at least point them out … instead, well, we know what gets the punditocracy excited!
* I also find it rather puzzling that any Jew should embrace the political movement involved with that change
***
BTW — WordPress, if you’re reading this: I know we can’t expect perfection from you given how little we pay you, but quit apologizing for your lapses in posting our comments. You aren’t sorry: you know it and we know it — so enough with the insensere (sp?) apologies already!
I also find it rather puzzling that any Jew should embrace the political movement involved with that change
As a Jew, there is a white-hot ball of rage inside of me because of just this issue.
O/T Roy alert-
Roy just did a wingnut classification article for the Village Voice illustrated by Tom Tomorrow.
He’s keeping track of the responses.
LOLzers.
Did I mention he assigns a Stupid/Evil Ratio to each blogger? Ace gets a 99/1.
F*** this. I’m tired of this site until somebody f***ing fixes WordPress.
His assessment of Chuckles over at LGF is probably the most spot-on.
Sadly, if I were to put on about 70 pounds I’d look like that cartoon version of the Pantload. I really wish he’d get rid of his occasional beard so I can keep mine.
Additionally, WordPress gets a Stupid/Evil ratio of 50/50.
2nd try….
mat–EXACTLY!! It’s as if they’re chomping at the bit! I’m using enough CAPS that I’m starting to feel like RELIAPUNDIT, but I don’t care I’m so hacked off at these racist bastards!
Then again, Kristol is being completely true to form here. His strange form, but still true to form.
Gosh, economic problems make people bitter. Wow. What kind of sick person could believe something like this?
We all know that economic problems only make people sing, dance, and look on the sunny side of life!
A party built on rum, sodomy and the lash is a different story.
The Pogues Party?
Your ideas seem intriguing to me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
A party built on rum, sodomy and the lash is a different story.
The Pogues Party?
Your ideas seem intriguing to me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
(And I second the motion that WordPress sucks.)
I think the real gaffe he made was to use the word cling. It is a bit of a pejorative, implying baby-like actions. And he admitted he didn’t choose his words well. Case closed.
Bitter? I got nothing.
If a good ol’ American religion like Christianity or Judaism endorses the eating of foie gras, it’s good enough for Kristol to endorse eating. – Righteous Bubba
I think we Jews are too blue-state. Our main concern right now is that there appears to be a shortage of quinoa (can be used as a grain but, not being a grain or a legume or cruciferous seed even, is a-ok for Passover without having to “matza-fy” it first) just in time for Passover.
Foie gras, maybe — but do good ol’ Americans eat quinoa?
BTW — yes, I’m being ironic — ain’t quinoa from the New World originally?
Although I guess it is from the
papistbrowngarlic eating(*) “south of the border” so it doesn’t count …* c.f. jokes about the fear of, um, “garlic eaters” amongst Anglo-American Protestants …
You mean the sprig tailed bastard cousin of lentils? Yep.
I used to eat a breakfast cereal of equal parts quinoa, amaranth, and kasha. Prepared like oatmeal.
It didn’t taste great, but you knew it was the colonic equivalent of a street sweeper. Yes, I was a fully invested DFH at that time. C’mon, I lived in Bellingham, for Dude’s sakes!
Pundit: Aieeee! Did you see what Obama’s pastor said? ZOMG Obama must be a black separatist! Aren’t you scared to vote for him now?
Heartland Obama supporter: (Yawn) No. I am scared I’m going to lose my job at Citimortgage. They just laid off a whole fuckload of my co-workers.
Pundit: Aieeee! Obama said you’re bitter and so stupid you’ll turn to God and Guns! He’s an elitist swine who thinks you’re all morons.
Heartland Obama supporter: I haven’t been in a church in 25 years, and I don’t personally know anyone who has a gun. I am bitter, though. I think they’re going to foreclose on my house.
Pundit: Obama thinks you should eat vegetables! Aieeee.
Heartland Obama supporter: So do I. If you’d ever driven by a hog confinement or looked into a chicken barn, you’d never eat meat again. But I don’t think Obama’s planning to convert you to veganitude at the point of a sword.
Pundit: Obama ate expensive ham!
Heartland Obama supporter: Yep, it might even have come from this little boutique farm south of Des Moines where they feed the hogs nothing but acorns. The piggies get a happy life of roaming about and eating gourmet hog food. People have ordered meat from there from all over the world. Yum!
Pundit: Isn’t there anything about the smug bastard you don’t like?
Heartland Obama supporter: Well, I don’t like it that he continued to vote to fund the war in Iraq. He doesn’t seem nearly inclined enough to get us a single payer healthcare system, either. I wish he was more to the Left.
Pundit: (claws own eyes out) Aieeeee!
Hey, T4T is right even when jesting!
“You shall follow the LORD your God and fear Him; you shall keep His commandments, listen to His voice, serve Him, and cling to Him.” Deuteronomy 13:4
“So I’ll cherish the old rugged cross
Till my trophies at last I lay down
I will cling to the old rugged cross
And exchange it some day for a crown”
Damn elitist Bible and old-timey hymns!
Sooooo … you think the Kristol’s cracked?
Also, from Mr. 212:
(emphasis added)
Now, let me get this straight – in order to criticize Barack Obama, from the left, you’re going to posit that the invasion of Iraq “protects America” in some vague, undefined sense?
Why should I buy into that?
Ha! Screw your WordPress! I beat you!
212 is a Sensible Liberal(TM), who you should thank for the last five glorious years.
I am a quasi-religious person myself and actually think “religion is the opiate of the masses” is pretty spot on. Like an opiate, religion can relieve pain and even start healing. But like an opiate, it can be addictive and destructive.
Darn it, you put that so much better than I could.
Re:” NOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooooooo!!!, if you look at the comments , Obama was being polite, and accepted a gift from supporter, not wimping out.Relax. I don’t think “they” can get him for this . (Maybe O’Reilly will try)
“Obama thanks the vet for his service and tells him that the pin means a lot coming from him.”
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/04/15/obama.flagpin.cnn
Candy, that’s about what I hear, more-or-less, even from people sucking on the FOX teat everyday . ” #&*%%#! assholes!” , and they don’t mean Obama .
The way you coddle these terrible people by insisting the have to be amusing. Has anyone noticed that the national police force of Canada is raiding the Prime Minister’s neoconservative party headquarters going on two days now?
And more to the point, do the Kristols have a spare room?
2nd Try:
Those “bitter” people would kick Kristol’s effete ass if he got stuck on their territory. I for one am sick to death of people who have their own household staff telling me what the hell “small town America” is like, particularly the guns & ammo side of it. I’m from Georgia and I live in fucking Kansas. Yet incredibly wealthy New Yorkers like Coulter and SheWhoShallNotBeNamed insist that they know what these people are like better than be because they’re all Republicans? And Kristol? Where’s Krauthammer (a.k.a. the world’s sexiest man…ROFLMAO) on this one? I’m sure he knows the mindset of the gun show crowd and could even explain it to them in words they wouldn’t understand if they looked them up in the OED.
Go on Billy Boy, ask the maid what it’s like to be less-than-upper-class. Ooops, pardon my bitter elitism.
from some of the analysis’ I’ve read of Marx, the whole ‘opiate of the people’ thing is vastly overplayed for what was actually a pretty good statement at the time.
Opium wasn’t considered as awful and horrible and terrible at the time Marx wrote his stuff as it is now that we’re enlightened and brilliant and modern and so above it all.
I remember reading the same point in a SF novel by Mack Reynolds back in the 1970s. However, it is clearly unpossible that a SF writer would understand the works of Marx better than a second-generation Straussian intellectual who has apparently lectured on the topic in front of real university students, so my memory must be at fault.
Kristol has shown that a comment by Obama can be misrepresented and misconstrued until it sounds a bit like an equally misconstrued bon mot by Marx… all in order to mention the two names in a column together (though without explicitly comparing them — that would be gauche). Sounds to me like he’s resorted to stealing Goldberg columns and stripping out the Simpsons references.
From wikipedia’s bio of Brill Kristol:
“Kristol graduated in 1970 from The Collegiate School, a preparatory school for boys located in Manhattan. In 1973 he received an A.B. from Harvard, graduating magna cum laude in three years. He received a Ph.D. in government, also from Harvard, in 1979. ”
2008-2009 tuition to The Collegiate School, for K – 12 grades, is $30,000.
I am sure he has a lot in common with Pennsylvania small-town blue collar folks.
Re. Opium.
What Patkin said. It might be better read as ‘the people’s anesthetic’ or whatever. I’m sure Kristol knows this and would even mention it if it would profit him.
Candy said,
April 16, 2008 at 21:23 (kill)
That was hilarious, Candy.
Actor212’s blog post is a different kind of hilarious altogether. I thought he was just a moron when he put up his typical white person post but I no longer think he’s serious. I think he’s parodying the worst of the Hillary Clinton supporters. Get a load of his commentary on the Plain People of AmericaTM and their attitudes on taxes:
It gets even better when he starts discussing the symbols of patriotism:
And that text is accompanied by this picture. It is too funny forever.
A pint of plain is your only man.
Bonapart–haven’t seen enough of these winger blogs with that same post yet, have ya? I’m gonna have to photoshop that damned pic if it shows up one more time….
A pint of plain is your only man.
Indeed.
Would also have accepted; “Yer nam is Jams O’Donnell” minus the destructive blow to my skull with an oar of course.
Yo mama is a Marxist!
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/new-news